Sarah: This is At the Core of Care, a podcast where people share their stories about nurses and their creative efforts to better meet the health and healthcare needs of patients, families, and communities. I'm Sarah Hexem Hubbard with the Pennsylvania Nursing Workforce Coalition and the Executive Director of the National Nurse-Led Care Consortium.
This is part one of a special maternal health series. On this episode, we're going to hear from Miyah Davis about how she became a doula after being a client with the Philadelphia Nurse-Family Partnership here at NNCC. Nurse-Family Partnership is an evidence-based home visiting model that serves first-time parents from pregnancy until their child turns two. Home visiting programs aim to strengthen families by walking alongside new parents and empowering them to reach the goals that they choose for themselves and their children.
This past year, NNCC worked with the Maternity Care Coalition (MCC) and the Pettaway Pursuit Foundation to not only increase access to dual services for clients enrolled in home visiting services, but also connect parents who had graduated from our programs with the opportunity to become a doula. For those who don't know, a doula is someone who offers individualized, physical, emotional, and informational support to clients before, during, and after childbirth, though they're typically best known for supporting mothers in labor and delivery. Our guest, Miyah Davis, became a doula at the end of 2024 and first connected with the Philadelphia Nurse-Family Partnership in 2019 when she was pregnant with her first child.
In addition to being a doula in her spare time, Miyah works a full-time job and is raising children with her husband.
Miyah, welcome to At the Core of Care.
Miyah: Hello. Thank you for having me.
Sarah: First off, congratulations to you on becoming a doula.
Miyah: Thank you so much. Thank you. Thank you.
Sarah: So could you tell us the story of how and why you decided to become a doula?
Miyah: I was working at a nursing home and I don't know, I just was feeling like this isn't necessarily my calling, like I want to go somewhere where life is just beginning, you know? But I didn't want to go to like nursing school. I didn't want to become a CNA or anything like that. And I also was like kind of in the middle of a identity crisis. 'Cause I really didn't know who I was outside of being a mother and a wife. So I didn't know what I wanted to do or where I wanted to go. I just knew that I didn't want to be in geriatric care anymore.
And it might sound a little cliche, but I did pray on it very, very hard. And it's like, right after I got done praying, I got a text and it was like a automated text that said, you know, Nurse-Family Partnership’s graduates are being granted scholarships to be able to become a doula. So I said, oh, thank you. God, you're, you're quick. That was fast. And I, um, I signed up with no questions asked. I didn't think twice about it and I just applied.
Sarah: Thank you for your interest and stepping up. So from what I understand, you're a doula right now for, is it eight clients?
Miyah: Yes.
Sarah: Yeah, so at what point during the client's pregnancy do you get matched up? What does the process look like?
Miyah: So every Monday, MCC sends a mass email to every doula. It's called a client match list, and we get to click the match list, and then we search through.
They don't have like their names or anything like that. It's like numbers and then it have their due date or where they're having their baby, and it has in quotations, if they have like a specific preference. You just go based off who you think is the best fit for you. One of my recent clients, she specifically says she wanted a Muslim doula, so I had asked to match with her, and in which I did, and we just had our first visit yesterday.
She is so sweet. She's so nice. But MCC doesn't allow you to have clients that like overlap, like the due dates overlap. Like if they're within the same timeframe or the same month, they'll tell you like, oh no, I don't think you should match with this one, because the due dates are too close together. So pretty much I have a client due almost every month this year, except for I think September, November, and December.
Sarah: Busy.
Miyah: Yeah.
Sarah: And how often do you interact with clients sort of leading up to labor and delivery?
Miyah: MCC grants us five visits, but I still talk to my clients pretty much every single day. I had one client that I actually was texting before I came here. Um, we talk like we're girlfriends, like, and we, we, we just matched with each other last week.
We keep in contact a lot. We have to spread our visits out, but we see each other a lot. I have a couple clients who I see outside of the five required visits. 'Cause I just feel like, sometimes you need that extra support. And everything doesn't have to be something that you're getting paid for. It doesn't have to be something that you have to be reimbursed for. Like I just do a couple visits outside of that from the heart and stuff like that.
Sarah: And are the five visits in person or telehealth, like what does that look like?
Miyah: It can be either in person or virtual. Usually my first visit, after the intake, is usually virtual. And you know, that just gives us like a little warm welcome. You know, we finally get to see each other face to face, I guess, through the phone.
And then after that we do in-person visits. But the birth is considered a visit as well, so we gotta make it stretch between birth and prenatal and postpartum.
Sarah: Could be a really long visit.
Miyah: Yes.
Sarah: So what types of conversations do you have with clients?
Miyah: During the intake, I kind of like try to break the ice. So if they have previous children, I typically ask for your previous deliveries, vaginal C-section. Are you going for a vbac? I like to ask about their past experiences and how they're juggling with being pregnant and having children.
But if they're like a first-time mom, I like to ask them like what their confidence level is and what exact support do they want from me.
Most of the times you have to ask them, do you even know what a doula is? Because a lot of them just sign up because they were asked. And they just like, yeah, just sign me up, sign me up. And then once I reach out, they're like, well, I don't even know what a doula is. So you definitely have to lead with that in most cases.
But I have a client now who, she did her research. She has an older child already, but she didn't have a doula with her oldest child, and she's trying to have like a VBAC or something now. She looked it up, she searched up what a doula was and what we offer. So she was telling me like. She was informing me, and I was like, okay, I don't gotta do, I don't have to explain too much here. She already knew what she wanted
Sarah: And I think it's a good call out. I gave a very brief definition of a doula, you know, in the start here, but I think it would be helpful, like, how do you explain that? What is a doula?
Miyah: So when someone asks me, what's the doula, I tell them, I'm there to advocate for you if you can't advocate for yourself. I'm there to make sure that your birth plan goes according to plan, with also being flexible to changes.
I also tell 'em that I'm there for emotional and physical support. I also have to let it be known, I'm not a midwife. I do not catch the baby. I do not take your vitals. I do not have a heartbeat. doppler, I don't do water births. I also have to explain that. But you know, I just tell 'em that I'm their plus one. I'm the companion of their companion. Because then you have some that have partners and stuff like that. I'm not here to replace your partner. I'm not here to be there instead of your partner. I'm just there to assist everyone and to make sure that the baby comes out safely and everybody's happy and healthy.
Sarah: So what was it like attending the first birth with one of your clients?
Miyah: My first client, she was going through like a sickle cell crisis and I was at my full-time job actually. Actually, she went in a lot earlier than she was supposed to, she had to stay in as an inpatient. And I let my job know. I'm like, listen, when my client says that she's six centimeters, I'm outta here. Like you, you, you knew I was a doula when I first signed up for this place. If she calls me, I'm out the door. I. But the labor process was going pretty slow. I work 12-hour shifts, so I'm like, I hope we can get through this day.
But with my first birth, it was more virtual. She was in a lot of pain. So I mainly spoke to her mother, and her mother was very informative. She was very communicative. She reached out to me every time she needed to know something, or if it was something that she was confused about. She kept me updated throughout the entire process, which means a lot in the doula world because sometimes you don't get updated. Sometimes you don't even know the baby's here until two days after the baby is born.
So I liked that her mom kept me involved, and of course I checked in every two hours. She was in a lot of pain, so her mom wanted to know how to help her with pain management. So I sent her different videos. I told her how to do the massages and I told her to let my client know how to like flip over and do different positions to like help manage her pain.
She tried to go as natural as she could for as long as she could, and she did a very, very good job. And her mom being there definitely made it like a plus one.
And, um. She made it through my whole shift without reaching six centimeters. It was about, I want to say 10:00 PM and she was like, oh, I'm four centimeters now. And I was like, okay. I am going to give me a little nap in and then I'll, I'll be there.
So I don't know how to drive, but my husband drives me everywhere. I'm, you know, they say passenger princess. I'm a passenger queen because I never get in the driver's seat. So, um, I'm telling him like, babe, we're on call. Make sure my doula bag is in the trunk, and if I say, get up. Get up.
So I went and took a nap, but he stayed up and she called me at like 11 and was like, I'm seven centimeters, seven. Oh my God. I had to jump out of the bed. I'm like, babe, she's seven centimeters. He running up the, you would think it was me that was having the baby like we got in the car.
When I tell you he was speeding down the street, you would've thought that it was me in labor, like he was making sure that I got there. We pulled up, I jumped out, I went in through the door. They was like, oh, you're the doula. You can go right upstairs.” It felt good. It felt like first class.
I went right up the steps and I walked in and I'm like, hello everybody, and there's all these doctors around her and I literally went, hello, everybody. And the baby was coming out. I’m like, oh my god. I feel like I done miss the whole thing, like the baby's here. Now, I'm like, well, at least I was, you know, here to see the baby come out. And I immediately rushed into action. I rubbed her head, I rubbed her arms. I watched her push out her placenta. She let everyone in the room like her mom and her dad ended up showing up as well.
It was a beautiful moment and she wanted to breastfeed and I told her about this video that was showed to us in the doula program, and it's basically saying how your baby can latch themselves and all you have to do is not wash off their hands and not wash off the breast because the hands have like a amniotic fluid smell and the breasts smell similar and the baby will like rest for a little bit, but then they'll gnaw on their hands a little bit and then locate the breast.
So I sent her the video so she was all for it. Soon as they pulled him out, she's like, don't wipe his hands. Don't wipe his hand. So I'm like, okay, he's not going to wipe his hand. She's still going to do it. Her dad cut the umbilical cord, they laid the baby down on her chest, and he was resting for a little bit.
You could tell he was very tired. He didn't cry. That was the first time I ever seen a baby come out without crying. He was so content, she was so calm. The baby was calm, the music was playing. It was just like very beautiful and it just felt so natural.
The baby was laying on her chest. He slept for like a good 10 to 15 minutes. Then he got up and started to gnaw on those fingers and she's like, let's lift him up a little bit. So she lift him up a little bit and he went searching for the nipple and I'm like, oh my God, he's doing it. So I'm in there jumping up and down and I'm cheering and I'm clapping, and. She's like, oh my gosh, he's going to find it.
And he did. He found it, but he couldn't like necessarily like latch on that much 'cause it wasn't really flowing. Because you know, right after birth it doesn't flow like that. So he would latch, then he would let go, and then he would gnaw his fingers and then he'll go back and latch again because he’s like, wait, I, I think I'm here, but I'm not sure.
But she remained very calm. She was very patient. And I kept telling her that she was doing a good job, kept encouraging her and giving her the nice words of affirmation. Her mom was also there, crying. I started crying because it was a beautiful thing for me. And I'm like, I never witnessed nothing like this before. And I had three kids. I need a redo.
Like, it was so nice. Um. And then she did skin-to-skin for two hours. I stayed for after the first feed and they delayed the weigh-in and stuff like that. She got up, used the bathroom quick. She bounced back fast, like I commend her. She did the thing. She did it. It was a good experience.
I got there right when the baby came out. The baby came out at 12:12 and I left at like 2:30 and I had to go to work at 8:00 AM.
Sarah: It's a good thing you got that nap in.
Miyah: Yes.
Sarah: So have you attended any other births since that first one?
Miyah: No, not yet. But I do have a client now that's being induced. So, I already let the job know once she six centimeters, gotta go.
And my husband already knows to be on standby, had the doula bag in the trunk because when I say Let's go it, it's time to go.
Sarah: So, during your first birth, what was your experience like? Did you have a doula or other birthing assistants?
Miyah: Well, with my first birth, I did have a doula. I'm not going to lie, I had a doula. But I wasn't aware that you could have preferences with your doulas.
And so I was a first time mom and my doula didn't have any kids, and we were the same age, and I was 20 at the time. So, you know, she was out having a ball. So.
You know what? My Nurse-Family Partnership nurse, she told me to look at the bright side of the situation. 'cause I complained to her about the fact that she didn't have kids and the fact that she doesn't have her own experience.
And at that time, you know, I was like, I don't know, like what can she teach me? And she was like, maybe you two can learn together. And I was like, you know what? Maybe we can. So I stay very optimistic about the situation after my nurse telling me that. And we got along good, but I didn't call her to the birth because I feel like it, probably was the hormones, but I was a little upset.
Because she went to, she went on a trip a week before my due date, and she was supposed to have like a visit two to three days after she came back home. And she just was like, “Oh no, I'm sick.” And then that's when we were supposed to do it three days after that. “Oh no, this came up.”
So it's like, you know, the baby is about to come soon and it's like, I can't reach you. You're not answering the phone. And I just was like, you know what? Okay. And my son was due January 14th, but I got induced January 6th. So I just said, I'm just going to just leave it where it's at. So I didn't call her. I probably should have.
After experiencing what I did during the labor process, I do regret not calling her. I should have called her so I could have that advocacy, so that I could have someone who was informative, even though I did learn a lot from her and my nurse, I feel like I should have called her. But she was there through my postpartum.
She went with me, um, up to the child support court and everything. So she was supportive in that aspect. Like after the baby was born, she went with me to the WIC office and she got my WIC for me a couple times as well. She was very, very helpful for the postpartum period. But no, I didn't call her for my birth.
But I had a doula for my other two births, it was the same doula. I called her again once I got pregnant with my third one. I called her again with my second one. I don't remember what agency I met her throug. 'cause none of my doulas were like through MCC. They were just something that my insurance referred me to.
But I met my second doula, and she was Black, she was Muslim, and she had kids and she was a wife. So I'm like, perfect. This is the one for me. This is for me.
She was very stern. She was very serious about her job and you could tell that she loved it. And she made me feel comfortable. She made me feel heard. She was there a lot through like emotional support. She was very supportive. And, um, when she came to my second birth, she answered every time I called her, if I called at 2:00 AM she answered the phone. If I called at 1:00 AM she answered the phone. She was on call. She was ready.
But she ended up missing when the baby came out. So when she came in the room, when my water broke, I started pushing. I wasn't supposed to, but I was pushing and she's in the room. My husband's in the room. My husband's on FaceTime with my mom and my mom's screen recording because we wanted to have a video when the baby came out.
So she comes in, she's putting her bag down. Everybody's talking and I'm just sitting in the bed with my legs gaffed open, looking around in complete agony and pain. Because I had the epidural, but. all my contractions went to my behind, so that's a pain I wouldn't wish on my worst enemy. So I'm in there in agony while everybody's just scrambling around.
Now it's time to push. So I push the first time and I'm, my jaw was already pushing when I wasn't supposed to, so I'm pushing, and his head instantly pops out. Mind you, my husband's on FaceTime. He's talking to my mom. She's in the corner putting her stuff away and pulling stuff out, and then. My husband has the camera on me this time, and he's ready.
And then she says something to my husband, which made him turn around, and then he turned back around and the baby was on my chest. So he missed it. And she missed it. They were like. Wait, what? When did the baby come out? My mom's on FaceTime. Like, wait, hold up, hold up, go back, put him back in. Do it over.
They're like, oh my gosh. Like when did you have the baby? I'm like, so y'all standing here? Neither one of you seen it. My husband like, no. She called me. I turned around, turned back around and he was on your chest and she like, I'm talking to you. It was, it was crazy. And um.
My third pregnancy with my daughter, I ended up having an emergency C-section, so she was on call, but she didn't come up due to the simple fact that you can only have one person in the room. But she did help me with like my postpartum care and stuff like that after that. So if I was to get pregnant again, I would most likely call her back again.
Sarah: I mean, anything involving birth is difficult to time, but I think that that story was next level on just how to the moment it can be.
So in your own journey to become a mother, clearly have a lot of experience and experience working with doulas, how did that experience shape the decision to become a doula?
Miyah: Well being though I had two different kinds of doulas. I had the experience of what kind of doula I kind of want to be like, and I also had the experience of a doula who I kind of don't want to be like. But she was still helpful in a way. And I do still appreciate her. Being though I had like a taste of both of those.
It inspired me to be someone who's consistent 'cause that's what a lot of the clients need. They need someone that's consistent and reliable and knowledgeable. Because a lot of clients who have like age gaps with their children or no children at all, they tend to rely on the elders in their family. And time's changed. Time has changed. Tom's isn't the same as 1999 when I was born, so you can't really always rely on Mama Shirley or Aunt Stephanie to get you through your labor. So it definitely inspired me to be for other people, what I had for myself.
I love working with people. I love babies. I love being supportive. I love being that person that someone can call on in their time of need and my experiences I had that I had someone that was there when I needed them. My first doula, like I said, we used to get my WIC for me, my other doula, she was there for a lot of my emotional support and a lot throughout my, um, prenatal and postpartum.
And I just wanted to be that for someone else. I just wanted to be there and always be there. And even if you feel like you don't have anyone, you got Maya.
Sarah: And I understand you had a, a really close relationship with your home visiting nurse. So how did that help with your first pregnancy? What was that like?
Miyah: She was amazing. I'm going to try not to cry 'cause I always get emotional when I talk about her because she was like the only consistent person in my life at that time. I went through a lot during my first pregnancy. My first child isn't by my husband. So I was in kind of a, like a toxic situation. And then um, I was going through a lot of drama at home with like my mom and my family and stuff like that.
I just feel like when you pregnant people test you 'cause they know you can't really do too much. So I just felt like I was being tested a lot and I felt abandoned by everybody but my nurse. It didn't matter where I was 'cause for a little while I was homeless. I didn't have anywhere to go. I was just house hopping between like friends and family members and stuff like that.
So for a little while, I really didn't have any stable place and I didn't know where I was going to go, what I was going to do. And, uh, my nurse was there. She was there. It didn't matter if I was in Allegheny on this week and y the next week, I could have been in Southwest the following week.
It didn't matter where I was. She was there. She didn't complain. She didn't seem frustrated. She didn't make it seem like I was a burden or anything like that or inconveniencing her. She was always a phone call away if she was going to be out or go on vacation or something like that. She always let me know ahead of time and it was still a way for me to reach her even though she would be on vacation.
I just felt like I owed it to her to be in a better position by the time my child reached two. I just felt like I had to be in a better position 'cause I felt like I would've failed her if she didn't leave knowing that I was okay. Like I felt like I would've failed her had I not done that. So I had to push myself.
Sarah: Well, I won't speak on behalf of your nurse, but I do know your nurse and I know that she, you know, thinks the world of you, um, and there's not a thing you could have done that would've made her question anything about your success. And my understanding is that you've also maintained a relationship.
Miyah: Mm-hmm. Yes.
Sarah: So that probably helped with getting a text a few years later.
Miyah: Yeah.
Sarah: Um, take, taking a risk on a, on a doula opportunity.
Miyah: Yes. Yes. I was just like, oh, did my nurse put my name on that, um, on that list because it was kind of crazy. But yes, it was amazing. And when we did the interview for MCC, it was a lot of us in this Zoom video. It was over 75 people. 'cause I remember seeing a bunch of little bubbles at the bottom and then it says 75 plus. So it was a lot of competition and I'm just like, well dang, they might not even pick me because there's so many people here. They asked about, you know, availability and everything like that and if you'll be able to travel back and forth.
I didn't know if I was going to be able to travel. And then the job that I was working at before the nursing home, it was very demanding. It was taking up majority of my time, like I barely even saw my kids and it was hard to even get a day off there. So I had to figure out how I was going to be able to have off on Tuesdays and Wednesdays to even be able to go to class.
So I ended up adjusting my schedule at the job. They allowed me to switch my days, which meant I was going to be there a lot more due to that. But. It worked out and I got it done thanks to my husband and thanks to my brother, because when my husband couldn't do it, my brother picked up the slack. So I did have a nice village behind me while I was in the MCC course.
Sarah: So reflecting on your own experience as a first-time parent, and even how you were able to connect with doulas in your own experience. Now you are a doula. How do you think about access to maternal healthcare and support in birthing?
Miyah: I think the access, I don't think it's fair in a lot of cases because for me, I got my doulas through my insurance.
Not a lot of people have insurance and sometimes some doulas rather have it out of pocket and the. Prices are ridiculous. Like one of my clients said one of her friends is a doula and wanted $2,000 for her to be her doula, which, you know, you pay what you feel like you're worth, you know?
But, um. Sometimes I feel like it can be very unfair and I feel like there's not enough promotion on it. If you're not going to a doctor's appointment or if you're not asking for resources, they're not throwing in your face, here's a doula. You have to show like you want something like that or have something going on to where people will offer doula services to you.
Like when my insurance offered it to me, they were just like, are you open to resources? Say for instance I had to said no, I would've never knew, like. Or say for instance I had to been one of those that just be like, uh, I don't, I don't really care for resources. You know? Sometimes some people aren't educated on it, so I feel like it's a little unfair.
I feel like the access to having a doula and that support, it definitely should be broadcasted more, and it definitely should have easier access, and it definitely should be something that people know in the beginning and not just if they need help.
Sarah: From your perspective, what do you think might benefit families more during the prenatal and postnatal stages? What other resources would be helpful?
Miyah: Lactation classes because nowadays breastfeeding is the thing, like everybody wants to breastfeed. Everybody understands the importance of breastfeeding, and I wish that I knew the importance of breastfeeding when I had my kids. My oldest son didn't get a drop because my stepmom and my father kind of scared me out of breastfeeding. They kind of told me I wouldn't have support if I breastfed. Second born I breastfed him for a little while, but it was kind of uncomfortable because his mouth was a little too small, so we had to use the shield and I didn't really do good with timing when to feed him.
Now I did breastfeed my daughter. About two weeks after she was born. I breastfed her for like a month until I just was like, Hmm, I'm tired of breastfeeding, I'm tired of pumping and I wasn't getting enough. And then she was like cluster feeding a lot. I wasn't really educated on that.
And you know, when you have the baby and they're trying to tell you the importance of breastfeeding and you got a baby in your arms, or if you got two toddlers running around the doctor's office, you ain't trying to hear that. I didn't want to hear anything about that. They were telling me how to eat and what to eat while the baby's crying and screaming.
It was overwhelming. So I feel like during like the prenatal stages, lactation should definitely be installed in the parents ahead of time so that they can mentally prepare themselves and have the patience somewhat when the baby comes.
Sarah: I think that's a great point in terms of the prenatal care, and I'm always really impressed when our pregnant clients come to our lactation support groups and I'm like, oh man, I wish I had thought of that.
I have twins and after they were born I needed a transfusion and I still remember. So when you have twins, they really push pumping like immediately 'cause they want to get your supply up. And they rolled in the giant hospital pump and I'm there like hooked up to the blood. It's like roll on out.
And I just, I still remember that so clearly because yeah, there's so much going on, especially in a hospital setting, people coming in and out, and it can be difficult to receive that information.
And breastfeeding is hard. It's hard. Every baby's different. Every mom's different. Um, so I hear you on the being as prepared as possible and knowing that you can't possibly be prepared for everything.
So anything else that you think would be helpful in advance?
Miyah: I also feel like birthing classes are important because a lot of my clients tend to look at other people's experiences and try to put their selves in that person's shoes. Just because that person was in labor for 48 hours doesn't mean you're going to be in labor for 48 hours. Just because that person said that the contractions hurt them, doesn't mean it's going to hurt you.
Everybody automatically thinks, oh, I'm with the epidural. You didn't even feel a contraction yet. Like you don't even know your pain tolerance in that aspect. So I feel like that should also be something that's pushed upon.
Sarah: Absolutely. That makes a lot of sense. So before we end our conversation for today, are there any final thoughts you'd like to share? Anything that you want to make sure that our listeners hear?
Miyah: I would like to say, you are doing a great job to all my mothers out there, all my birth people out there, you're doing a great job.
Don't ever get discouraged if your birth doesn't go according to what you planned or written down. Everything happens for a reason. You're a great mother. You're a great parent. You're a good provider.
Always take some time out for yourself. Self-care is definitely important. Sometimes we lose ourselves and we tend to lose our identities when we are parents or become parents.
Your child is in the best hands and, like my nurse at home nurse used to tell me, nobody loves your child like you can. Nobody can do for your child the way that you do. And to the partners of the birthing people, you are amazing. You are just as important. You matter as well. And we are thankful for you, for your support, for your helping hand, for you also being a voice to the one that's bringing the baby in the world. 'Cause we tend to forget about the people that support and my, know, my husband was a great support. So, yeah.
Sarah: Miyah, thank you so much for responding to that text, for going through the program, for entering this amazing, crazy world of doula care and certainly for sitting down with us today at At the Core of Care.
Miyah: No problem. Thank you so much for having me. Thank you. Thank you. I hope my words touch some people.
Sarah: Special thanks to Maya Davis for joining us. In part two of this series, we will talk about policies surrounding doula care and opportunities for the future. You can find our most current and past episodes of At the Core of Care, wherever you get your podcasts, or at panursingworkforce.org.
For more information about upcoming webinars and trainings for nurses to obtain continuing education credits, log on to panursingworkforce.org.
On social media, you can stay up to date with us through our handles @nurseledcare and @PA Nursing Workforce. At the Core of Care is produced by Stephanie Marudas of Kouvenda Media and mixed by Brad Linder. I'm Sarah Hexem Hubbard of the Pennsylvania Nursing Workforce Coalition and the National Nurse-led Care Consortium.
Thanks for joining us.
